Episode 177: Couples That Work

“It’s framed as a choice question: how do you pick the right person? But I found the right person and then things started to get complicated...you want a career and you’re deeply in love with someone. Then what?”

— Jennifer Petriglieri

Jennifer (R) and I during our interview

Books and articles offer career advice OR relationship advice. They rarely consider the link between the two. Yet dual-career couples are everywhere, and anyone who's part of one knows your careers can only run in parallel for so long At some point, life is going to get complicated - and not only if you have kids.

So how do you make it work?

INSEAD professor Jennifer Petriglieri, author of Couples That Work, has spent years researching working couples and learning from their experiences. In this episode we talk about the three transitions couples go through over the decades, and what her research (and her own career and home life) have taught her about the roadblocks couples face, and how to navigate them.

You can also read a transcript of the show.

Next time you’ll hear a short show where Jennifer answers listeners’ questions about their own dual-career dilemmas.

Episode 176: Thinking Differently: Neurodiversity at Work

“It is a feminist issue. There are so many women who are not being diagnosed or who are misdiagnosed. [And] boys and men are diagnosed.”

— Emma Case

“He basically said, ‘You know, everything looks great. There’s nothing of concern, but I will say that you have a large part of your brain missing.’”

— Michelle Jones

Michelle jones

“Having some knowledge that some people think a little bit differently, and that to play to their strengths is going to give you the best working team you could possibly have, is really important. ”

— Paige Jeffrey

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emma case

This show is all about working with neurodiversity - having a condition such as ADHD, or Asperger’s or anything else that means your brain functions a bit differently from a lot of your colleagues’.

Emma Case had always wanted to work in fashion, and she loved it - but at the same time she had trouble with things that seemed totally straightforward to others. It took years to work out why. That’s a theme running through this show. All three of my guests went undiagnosed until well into adulthood.

Emma now runs Women Beyond the Box, a platform that celebrates the successes of neurodiverse women.

paige jeffrey

Michelle Jones and Paige Jeffrey are in this category too. Paige often found the office a confusing environment but didn’t know why until last year. Michelle’s world was rocked when, in her late thirties, she received some shocking news about her brain.

All three women have struggled at times, but they’ve all learned to use their particular brains to fuel their success. And each of them wants workplaces to open up, to be more inclusive - to recognize that neurodiversity can be a benefit to a project or a team rather than a hindrance.

You can also read a transcript of the show.

The podcast Home. Made. is sponsoring TBE this month. Check it out. Host Stephanie Foo has an amazing background. She even guest-taught a class with me once.

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Further reading:

The Female Burden of Neurodiversity, from The Week.

From the American Psychological Association, a piece on Dr. Ellen Littman and her work with women and girls with ADHD. She was an early advocate for women with ADHD.

Episode 175: Rejecting Resilience

“It’s learning that you can be more than that and that you can say no, and it’s okay to say, ‘I don’t have time to do that. And no, I’m not as strong as you think I am and I can’t do five jobs.’”

— Omolara Uwemedimo

Ashley and omolara during our interview

“For me it was important to say that Black women deserve quality mental healthcare, they deserve the space to connect with one another, to receive support and to heal.”

— Camesha Jones

In this show we consider the idea that resilience is overrated.

When Omolara Thomas Uwemedimo attended medical school she learned to be stoic and to power through. But during her career as a pediatrician and professor, she powered through so much that her body turned on her. She says too many Black women are supporting their workplaces - and everyone else - to the detriment of their health. They’re putting up with a lot and keeping their heads down when they need to speak up. She wants to change that.

camesha jones

Therapist Camesha Jones was a student when she experienced a mental health crisis. Today she's bringing mental healthcare to women in Chicago whose needs have too often not been met. Mental health, she says, "is the gateway to having the life that you want."

You can also read a transcript of the show.

Show notes:

Camesha Jones’ social venture is Chicago-based Sista Afya.

Melanin & Medicine is the business Omolara Uwemedimo founded in the wake of her health crisis. She works with other Black women in medicine and academia on their careers, work/life balance, and tackling racism and sexism at their institutions. She is also the CEO of Strong Children Wellness, which provides holistic care to children and families.

One thing Omolara mentioned that didn’t make it into the finished show: these days far more Black women than men become doctors. This page from the Association of American Medical Colleges bears that out. Since the mid-’80s the percentage of Black women graduating from medical school has leapt from around 40% of Black graduates to about 65%.

Episode 174: Alcohol and Work

“I would never advocate for removing alcohol from the workplace. But...if we are not going to make it so that the person who goes out to the bar the latest gets the best bonding experience and opportunities, we have to be conscious.”

— Lisa Smith

“It’s a whole gender role thing, right? We’re supposed to be good women, good mothers, good wives. So we’re demonized I think, when we have these issues. ”

— Dawn Nickel, She Recovers Foundation

Lisa smith

A lot of workplaces use alcohol as social glue. My abiding memories of my first job involve copious glasses of red wine drunk at the pub at lunchtime on Fridays. I don’t remember much about the insurance industry, but that job did teach me how to hold my liquor. There was definitely social pressure to drink. A lot. But drinking is easier on male bodies than female ones.

When Lisa Smith started out as a lawyer in the '90s she spent multiple late nights out drinking with colleagues. But the pressures of work had her drinking at home too, and by the time she was in her thirties she was an alcoholic. Today, she’s the author of the memoir Girl Walks Out of a Bar, and she works with law firms to make their cultures less alcohol-dependent, and to break the stigma around addiction in the legal profession.

And we meet Dawn Nickel of She Recovers to talk about the issues women face in seeking treatment for substance use, and how the pandemic has affected women in recovery.

You can also read a transcript of the show.

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Further reading: She Recovers offers support to women in recovery from substance use, intimate partner violence, eating disorders and more.

American Bar Association study on substance use among lawyers in the U.S.

New York Times piece on how drinking rose during Covid, and how to cut back.

Stress in America, a report from the American Psychological Association on health concerns that have arisen during the pandemic. The report states that 29 percent of mothers report an increase in their drinking during the past year. 48 percent of fathers say the same.

From NPR, a piece about the big rise in alcoholic liver disease in young women during the pandemic.

Episode 173: A Nanny Speaks Up (re-release)

“I really ask for what I want now. I prepare a questionnaire when I go for interviews...This is an irregular situation that you’re in. Somebody’s home becomes your workplace. It’s not like walking into an office. ”

— Jennifer Bernard

“Professional women need somebody to look after the house, and that hasn’t gone away. But it is something that makes many people very uncomfortable.”

— Alison Wolf

Jennifer Bernard

The pandemic has hit those with the most precarious jobs, worst. According to a survey by the National Domestic Workers Alliance, at the peak of Covid in New York City in May of 2020, 40 - 60 percent of domestic workers there were out of a job. That includes nannies, housekeepers, and home health aides.

This time we re-visit an episode I first produced several years ago where a nanny and a labor market expert are the stars.

Alison Wolf's book has a provocative sub-title: How the Rise of Working Women Has Created a Far Less Equal World. First I talk to Alison, a professor at King's College London (and, since I first talked to her, a member of Britain’s House of Lords). Then we spend the rest of the show with Jennifer Bernard, a Trinidad-born, New York-based nanny. We hear about the unequal work environment that is the home, how she began to gain confidence on the job, and what makes her feel successful.

You can also read a transcript of the show.

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The Broad Experience is currently featured on London-based Oriel Partners’ website. They’ve produced their own podcast for executive assistants, or PAs, in British parlance.

This month the show is being sponsored by the podcast Remote Works, which focuses on the worldwide shift to working remotely. Great stories here.

Episode 172: Speaking While Female

“They would say, ‘are you a man?’ The insinuation being if you were standing there speaking you were overstepping your role, stepping out of your gendered role and into the territory of male behavior.”

— Dana Rubin

This episode takes a step back in time to look at the history of women as public speakers, and how the past relates to the present.

Dana Rubin

If you look at history books or speech anthologies, you might assume women didn't say very much in public until the 20th century. But that's far from the case. My guest, speechwriter and coach Dana Rubin, has compiled a speech bank of women's speeches going back hundreds of years. Women were speaking up...it's just that HIStory wasn't interested. And that legacy, Dana argues, affects the way women see themselves as speakers today.

You can also read a transcript of the show.

Toward the end of the podcast we talk about the ‘comic’ images created in the early 20th century of women having their tongues cut off, or mouths bound. There are plenty to see. This image - a screen grab from eBay - is one Dana mentions.

For sale on eBay

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Further reading:

Check out the Speaking While Female speech bank. And please contact Dana if you have a speech you think belongs there.

A listener alerted me to the legacy of longtime speech coach Denise Graveline, who died in 2018. She was a big advocate for women speakers and hosted the sites The Eloquent Woman and Don’t Get Caught. Her family has gathered all her content onto one site and there is tons of useful stuff there. In her Famous Speech Friday posts she would highlight a female speaker and then give a bit of background on her, her speech, and what you could learn from it.

This is the episode I produced in 2016 that divided listeners on the topic of whether or not women should ‘improve’ their vocal presentation. It has a very similar title to this show.